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For Drew Barrymore, tidying up is all about clearing her head.

In an interview with Real simple Published on wednesday, Barrymore spoke about the lessons she hopes to pass on to her two daughters, who shares with her ex-husband, Will Kopelman.

In adding to teaching say the importance of being kind to others, Barrymore Says and Encourages say to see the value of Caring for their Environment.

“And i’ve taught say that if you clean up after you, you’re going to have more Calmess in your space. Your head is as messy as your room is.

Although Mess “Can Be Cute and Charming,” They Have to Be Tidied Up Eventually, Said.

“I have one daughter who’s neater than i will be, and one daughter who is beyond Messy. But someone reminded with mesy mesy i ung. And i was like, oh my god, i’m expert her to have my 50 -ear-op. Barrymore Said.

Along with Teaching the Value of a Tidy Space, The Talk Show Host Says She Wants to Normalie Therapy for Her Daughters.

“And i will try to show say that the most you work on yourelf, the happy you’re going to be, the most friendships Will Thrive. We All Need to Navigate the World, and Ascing for Help is Everynding,” She Said.

Barrymore added that she thinks of therapy the way that that that People think ecout exercise.

“Treat Therapy as if it is the Most Basic, Normal, Welcomed Thing,” She Said. “Nobody Questions IF Someone Wants to Go to the Gym, but Somehow, Therapy Can Have a Stigma. Yeah, have a lot of the cellulite, but my brain is functions in a way i’m not devastated.”

A representative for Barrymore did not immediately respond to a request for comment sent by business insider.

Decluttering Can Be A Good Tool for Destresing Since It Helps Restore A Sens of Control, Clinical Psychologist Dawn Potter Said, For the Cleveland Clinic. Not Only That, Decluttering Can Also Provide A Sense of Accomplishment.

Howver, Doing a Major Declutter, Like with the viral Konmari Method, Can Actually Create Anxiety for Some People, Dr. Daniel Levitin, A Neuroscientist, Told Business Insider in 2019.

“Some People take Comfort in Knowing ‘i have a hammer i haven’t used in five years and have a Handyman, but if i ever will need Hammer, It is there,’” Levitin Said.

Keiyaa, The Chicago-Born, New York-Based Soul Musician, Singer-Stonger, and Producer, has announce a new album. Her sophomore lp is titled Hooke’s Law and Comes Out October 31 VIA Xl. Featured The Record is the New Song “Take”And its moody, Low-Lit Music Video is Co-Directed by Catory arthrur and Keiyaa. Watch It Below and Scroll Down for Keyyaa’s UpComing Tour Dates.

“An album about the Journey of Self Love, from an angle that isn’t all affirmations and capitalistic self-core. “With this work, i Aim to interrogate and embrace Ange and Conflict, Disappointment and DissatisFaction, About Not Being Docil and About Rejecting Mammyism and Traditional Expectations of Fat Black and Dark Skinned Women in Our Community. About Maladaptive tendencies, conflict avoidance – the Eternal Relationship with the self. ”

Hooke’s Law Follows Keyyaa’s Breakout Debut Album, 2020’s Forever, ya girlHer 2022 Single “Camille’s Daughter,” and Her Full-Elegth Stage Production, Milk saythat Ran in New York. The new lp was Written, sung, and produced by keyyaa Herself over the past five years, in address to her playing every instrument on the songs. Also Included on the Length Tracklist is the single “Stupid Prizes.”

Revis The Rising Interview “Keiyaa’s Divine Soul.”

Hooke’s Law:

01 Waltz d’Hetrt
02 i h8 u
03 Stupid Prizes
04 take it
05 Be Quiet !!!
06 Think About it / What u Think?
07 kiss
08 Make Good
09 this time (ft. Rahrah gabor)
10 Lateeee
11 Get Close 2 with
12 Fire Sign Oath
13 Motions
14 Motions (Reprise)
15 BREAK IT
16 Thirsty
17 devotions
18 Nobody Show
19 UNIL WE MEET AGAIN

Keiyaa:

10-06 Los Angeles, Ca – The Wiltern *
10-11 Seattle, Wa – The Showbox *
10-13 brooklyn, NY – Brooklyn Paramount *
10-14 Washington, DC – 9:30 Club *
10-15 Washington, DC – 9:30 Club *
10-18 Washington, DC – 9:30 Club *
10-19 New York, NY – Terminal 5 *
11-01 Hamburg, Germany – überjazz Festival
11-06 brussels, Belgium – ancienne Belgique
11-07 uTrecht, netherlands – let guess who?
11-08 Bristol, England – Simple Things Festival
11-13 London, England – Corsica Studios

Ravyn Lenae: Performing Live in the United States & Europe (2025)

Photo-Illustration: Joe Darrow

This article was featured in One Great Story, New York’s reading recommendation newsletter. Sign up here to get it nightly.

A mommy influencer in Louisville, Kentucky, is hawking a cucumber face wipe on Instagram. She leans into the camera and presses a moist tissue to her chin. She tells her audience she swears by it. Later that day, she’s back online to conscript her blond toddler son into a sponsored post for a children’s book called Pete the Hungry Pig. Her name is Kaelin Armstrong Dunn, and she is 29 years old. She has five children, a husband, and pets. She shills relentlessly. Chex. Duracell. An invention that detects alcohol content in breast milk. At 47,400 followers, Dunn qualifies as a top-tier micro-influencer and is tantalizingly close to the sponcon big leagues.

Ninety-nine percent of the time, Dunn stays on brand. Except in early November 2019, a few days after the face-wipe post, she publishes an uncharacteristic #ad for Kentucky Democratic gubernatorial candidate Andy Beshear. “A few reason (sic) I plan to vote for Andy Beshear is because he’s not Matt Bevin, he’s a democrat and he wants to fix the pension plan for for (sic) ALL teachers and not just SOME!,” she writes. In the photo, she is holding a child. “He also wants to get rid of right to work, he’s pro union, and my favorite he gets his kids their shots 😂!”

Dunn may well support Beshear, who defeated the Republican incumbent, Matt Bevin, the next day by a mere 5,086 votes. But she plugged him online because a Manhattan-based tech entrepreneur named Curtis Hougland paid her $100 to. Hougland, 52, runs a 13-person start-up that hires social-media influencers to do cheerful propaganda for political clients — in this case, the Kentucky Democratic Party. Once their posts are out in the wild, his firm, Main Street One, plucks high-performing content and turns it into digital advertising. On Election Day, the party ran Facebook ads featuring Dunn’s Instagram post.

“People don’t want journalistic content — this idea of ripping a headline from the Grand Rapids paper and making it into an ad,” Hougland says. Instead, his idea for 2020 will be to mobilize this influencer brigade against the president. “So if Trump said to the people of Youngstown, Ohio, ‘Don’t sell your homes or mortgages, because your job’s going nowhere’ and then the GM plant closes? At that moment, you gotta be ready with your creator network.”

Hougland’s shop, which began operating earlier this year, announces itself with the high-minded tagline “We Fix Internet Discourse.” Hougland, sandy-haired and cherub-faced, has a resistance crusader’s faith that the forces standing in the way of Democratic victory are partisan fake news and foreign disinformation. “We’re not going to make up information,” he tells me. “We’re not going to use bots.” Just the opposite, he argues. What could be more real than a first-person testimonial? (So what if it’s pay-for-play?) And while his righteous indignation can seem at odds with his current venture, he’s one of the few Democrats pushing the envelope on the staid left-wing internet. For many progressives, the question seems to be whether they can have an impact online without further messing with democracy. In other words, how far will they go to win?

A decade ago, in the era of proverbial hope and change, the internet was Democratic territory. Like Hollywood, like the music industry, it was run by media elites and young people, rendering it seemingly impenetrable to conservatives. Maybe it was complacency, or maybe it was a certain vital energy shifting to the weirder, darker corners of the social web rather than the ad-agency-approved mainstream of microtargeted emails, but there’s a consensus that Democrats lost the internet in 2016. Or, really, lost Facebook, which has become tantamount to losing the internet. There was, of course, Russian disinformation and Macedonian fake news, but also there was a social-media strategy based on ironic memes, conspiracy signaling, and invented content that has since become de rigueur in the Republican Party. For instance, in November, on the first day of impeachment hearings, the Arizona congressman Paul Gosar, elected in the tea-party wave of 2010, crafted a 23-tweet thread defending the president. Together, the first letters of each tweet spelled out “Epstein didn’t kill himself.”

This election cycle, Democrats are again struggling to compete. Lefty Twitter is active and funny but is mainly devoted to tearing down centrist-seeming Democratic candidates (like “Mayo Pete,” as his extremely online antagonists have christened him). Instead, almost all of the most-viral content is coming from the Trump right. A video of Joe Biden massaging his own shoulders was created by a Kansas-based meme-lord who goes by Carpe Donktum and was invited to the White House over the summer. Both Donald Trump and Donald Jr. tweeted it out. The parody site JoeBiden.info — now advertising JOE BIDEN TOUCHED ME T-shirts, in what looks like official campaign font — was created by someone working for Trump’s reelection campaign. After climate activist Greta Thunberg was named Time’s Person of the Year, the campaign Photoshopped Trump’s head onto her body and used the parody cover in a tweet.

“If you talk to Democratic institutions, they have a research team; they have a mobilization team that has an earned-media, paid-media, and social-media person. They have all these silos,” Hougland says. Trump, by contrast, understands that “it’s not paid or earned. Not fake or real. Not machine or human. Not foreign or domestic. All part of the same discourse.” (And, not insignificantly, he’s also outspending all the leading Democrats online.)

Democrats are trying to course-correct. LinkedIn founder Reid Hoffman has emerged as an internet-first megadonor whose resistance-y fund Investing in Us is backing the political tech accelerator Higher Ground Labs (not to be confused with Higher Ground Productions, the Obamas’ Netflix shop), which is in turn funding Hougland’s influencer gambit. A lot of cash is pouring into a buzzy digital agency called Acronym, led by Obamaworld veterans. And then there’s Mike Bloomberg, who is planning an unprecedented nine-figure digital-ad campaign.

It’s not yet clear what kind of national appetite there is for sponsored Instagram posting. Politicians have balked at paying influencers, and it’s harder to get social-media personalities to create pro bono content for individual candidates than for causes, like abortion rights or climate change. For the most part, Beshear preferred volunteers, and as a result, many of the 122 influencers who flacked for him in Kentucky looked less like apolitical moms and more like activists — which wasn’t ideal.

It’s one thing to invest in digital media. It’s another to get a distractible and polarized electorate to pay attention to it, and bend the rules of polite discourse in your direction. Especially if to “go low,” as Michelle Obama decreed, goes against implicit party rules. “We historically have tried to be very controlled and disciplined with our messages,” says Higher Ground Labs co-founder Shomik Dutta. “But while you may have more integrity, (you) are limited to where it can go and where you can push it. So we need a way around that — without losing our integrity.” Or, as one staffer for an expired Democratic presidential campaign put it to me, “I think the difference between the Republicans and the Democrats is the Republicans have no compunction about creating content that’s complete bullshit.”

Why doesn’t the left have its own Breitbart? David Brock, the Clinton dirt digger turned loyalist, asked himself the same question. He presides over the massive Democratic opposition-research shop American Bridge. Once upon a time, American Bridge was cutting edge. It started the video-tracking revolution, deploying dead-eyed camerapeople to trawl Republican events around the country. By late 2016, Brock, reeling from Hillary Clinton’s loss, announced he was turning his pro-Clinton website Shareblue into a “Breitbart for the Left.” Now rebranded the American Independent, the site has built up an impressive following, but its HuffPost-style journalism doesn’t seem to have made a dent outside the liberal bubble. A handful of nimbler outfits have begun experimenting.

The first major opportunity came in late 2017 before the special election between Doug Jones and Roy Moore for the Alabama Senate seat vacated by incoming attorney general Jeff Sessions. Watching from New York was David Goldstein, a buzz-cut 40-year-old who lives on Roosevelt Island. He had worked in the Obama years for A-list Democratic polling firms and in 2017 was employed at a midtown PR firm. Goldstein is a self-taught data analyst with an intense, obsessive personality — he trained to be an opera singer in his 20s — and his new focus was voter persuasion.

Like Brock, he was fixated on Breitbart and its ultrarich patron, Robert Mercer. But hyperpartisan content wasn’t likely to win political converts. To change minds in Alabama, he’d have to obscure his partisan intentions. Goldstein called his operation Tovo Labs, which sounded techie and official, but it was basically just him, during off hours, working from his laptop. The plan: He would create targeted digital ads aimed at three cohorts of Alabama voters — Democrats, moderate Republicans, and conservative Republicans — to swing votes in Jones’s direction. Many of the ads themselves were dinky little animated gifs and would run everywhere from Facebook to Infowars to the Times. By design, they’d look like the kind of cheapo stuff heavy Facebook users tend to click on.

Goldstein’s Democrats were fed ads bearing messages like “Our Democracy Will Fail Without You” and were directed to a website that allowed them to look up their polling places. Moderate Republicans got “Don’t Be Ashamed to Vote” and “Vote for Honor Dec 12,” leading them to testimonials from Alabama conservatives urging write-in votes for Luther Strange, the Establishment Republican whom Moore had defeated in the primary.

Then came the conservative voters. “As far as I know,” Goldstein says, “nobody blatantly bragged about going after the other side’s base with a dedicated digital-ad campaign until Trump’s guy did.” He’s referring to Brad Parscale, Trump’s 2016 digital director and current campaign manager. “So I was like, ‘Let’s suppress the vote.’ ” Conservatives got ads that read, “Alabama’s Great Shame” or “Destroying Alabama’s Honor,” and they were directed to news clips of prominent Evangelicals arguing against Moore’s candidacy. (Goldstein came up with his ad copy using social psychologist Jonathan Haidt’s research on political tribalism.)

Goldstein wasn’t the only Democrat using the special election as a petri dish. Matt Osborne, a native Alabamian and gadfly activist, created a social-media campaign suggesting that Moore supported alcohol prohibition to try to freak out moderate Republicans. An Austin-based disinformation-research outfit, however, reportedly created a “pro-Moore” Facebook page in order to feed its followers anti-Moore content. Both efforts were indirectly funded by Hoffman’s Investing in Us. (The Austin firm has been linked to a “false flag” effort to sic fake Russian Twitter bots on Moore’s campaign, but the firm’s CEO wouldn’t talk to me and no one can really figure out if that’s true.)

What differentiated Goldstein’s efforts were his attempts to demonstrate that he had affected the race. He picked three state-senate districts that would see the ads and three comparable districts that wouldn’t. He sent out his experimental group, and from there, he measured turnout. The results were remarkable: In each district where he ran the experiment, Democratic turnout was substantially higher than expected and conservative turnout substantially lower. (In previous years, turnout had been almost identical in the control and the treatment districts.)

There’s virtually no way the Democratic turnout spike, let alone Jones’s victory, was Goldstein’s doing alone. His reach wasn’t wide enough. And it’s possible he had no effect at all. But in a race decided by a just few more than 20,000 votes, his ads — which cost $85,000, were aimed at a sliver of the state, and ran for seven days prior to the election — were seen over 4 million times. At a minimum, you wonder what might have happened if he’d been able to scale up.

If liberals can’t quite bring themselves to be Breitbart, maybe there are other ways to win Facebook. (And anyway, Breitbart’s audience has been in decline.) The biggest buyer of Facebook ads during the 2018 midterm election was erstwhile liberal savior Beto O’Rourke, then running for Senate in Texas, according to data from an online transparency project at NYU. The second-biggest buyer was an outfit nobody had heard of called News for Democracy. Based in Colorado, it apparently operated in tandem with three opaque sister LLCs. The group ran no fewer than 48 Facebook pages targeting different audiences: BroAmerica, Women for Civility, Melanin, Better With Age. Many of these pages had accumulated anywhere from 5,000 to 12,000 subscribers sharing memes or news articles relevant to their subject matter a couple of times a day.

The ads promoting each of these pages evinced loosely pro-liberal messages tweaked to match the sensibility of its intended audience. For instance, Drain the Swamp News shared memes that painted Brett Kavanaugh as a deep-state tool. Some pages went after sitting Republicans; others blasted more generic content in states with close Senate elections with names like Gulf State News or That’s Just North Dakota.

The highest-spending page, at $1.2 million, was Our Flag Our Country. One of its ads targeted mostly at women in New York State, which earned between 10,000 and 50,000 impressions, featured a video of a middle-aged white guy complaining into the camera. “How do I feel when I turn on the TV on a Sunday and see a wealthy celebrity player take a knee?,” he asked. “Frankly, it bothers me.” But, he continued, it bothers him even more that Trump uses the issue to divide the country. A Trump voter in 2016, he’d be voting Democrat in the midterms. An entirely different ad for an entirely different page featured a younger guy in a hoodie reciting a nearly identical script. How did he feel about football players who took knees? Actually, he felt pretty good about it! He’d be voting Democrat in November. It’s impossible to tell from the ads whether the men are paid actors.

These pages were traced back to a 32-year-old ex-Vice and Bloomberg journalist named Dan Fletcher, who ran a Denver creative agency called MotiveAI, which was funded by — what else? — Hoffman’s Investing in Us. News for Democracy, timed to the midterm elections and walking the line on fake news, was Hoffman’s gutsiest play yet.

Fletcher’s goal wasn’t to reproduce viral clickbait with a leftward slant, though. It was to slip liberal messaging to audiences that didn’t necessarily trust liberals. “The question is,” says one MotiveAI backer who wasn’t authorized to speak on the record, “Is there anything that can be done to actually deliver facts to groups that otherwise refuse to hear them because of the messenger?”

Facebook’s potential for subtle propaganda hasn’t totally been lost on other Democrats. During the midterms, Ohio gubernatorial candidate Richard Cordray ran ads under a bland page called Ohio Newswire. The Environmental Defense Fund did likewise, using Breaking News Texas. But in terms of scale and audacity, nobody came close to Fletcher.

A few weeks after the midterm elections, the New York Times and the Washington Post published stories about the “Russian style” tactics in Alabama. Several people involved had their Facebook accounts removed. Hoffman apologized, although Investing in Us has clarified that his own money didn’t fund the prohibitionist false flag. Fletcher’s project, which had far greater reach, didn’t violate any Facebook rules. “There is a substantive moral difference in disseminating misinformation versus creating misleading IDs and disseminating facts,” a Fletcher backer told me, echoing a common sentiment in Hoffman’s political orbit. Still though, following some unwanted PR around a misogynistic Facebook page aimed at “Keg Bros,” News for Democracy all but ceased publishing in the wake of the election. Hoffman, meanwhile, has ramped up his giving to the Democratic National Committee.

David Goldstein’s career as a digital ratfucker didn’t last long either. After Doug Jones pulled off the upset, Goldstein signed on to create Alabama-style Facebook ads for Andrew Gillum’s Florida gubernatorial bid. But when Gillum’s people saw the ads — some voters were served a big-headed, orange-faced caricature of Trump — they freaked out and yanked them. The last time I spoke with him, Goldstein was advising a couple of guys from a labor union in Australia.

But the presidential race brought new pressure to create alternatives to paid media — not unlike what Fletcher, Goldstein, and Hougland had been attempting to do. In September, President Trump’s reelection campaign released a false ad on Facebook, YouTube, and Twitter that repeated one of the several dubious Ukraine-Biden theories at the heart of the Republican impeachment defense. Facebook, per its policy, refused to remove it. Google, however, has since decided to restrict targeted political ads, and Twitter has banned political ads altogether.

“With less ability to target with our advertising online, we will not be able to be as granular,” says Betsy Hoover, who ran digital organizing at Obama for America and is the other co-founder of Higher Ground Labs. “We’ll have to rely even more on rapid and authentic content creation.”

But nobody on the liberal mainstream seems very good at “rapid and authentic” at the moment. In October, an MIT graduate and Silicon Valley veteran named Misha Leybovich created something called the Warren Meme Team, news of which broke in the Times. No memorable pro-Warren memes have resulted; instead, the Reddit page r/WarrensMemeTeam immediately became populated with anti-Warren memes. Meanwhile, top Democratic advocacy group Priorities USA began experimenting with a new tactic to complement its massive battleground-state media buys: populating social-media pages in Michigan, Pennsylvania, Florida, and Wisconsin with locally focused content. As of press time, its four Facebook pages have accumulated a total of 289 likes. (A Priorities spokesperson said the numbers were low because the pages were mainly meant to reach journalists. “We’re not trying to organically get our content in front of voters. We pay to do that.”)

With the exception of Andrew Yang’s #yanggang and some ironic Marianne Williamson love on Twitter, the candidates themselves have mostly failed to channel the internet Zeitgeist. Cory Booker hired a “millennial and influencer engagement” director, but Booker’s girlfriend, Rosario Dawson, has probably had more success in that department simply by appearing with the candidate on-camera. The Pete Buttigieg campaign’s brand bible of shareable logos and typefaces — so fans can create their own official-looking content — are as uncool as they sound. Would-be digital pioneer Beto O’Rourke just wound up livestreaming his campaign’s demise.

One of the Higher Ground investments is in a company called Wethos, which aims to match campaigns with creatives. I mentioned to Wethos’ marketing director, Anjelica Triola, that I wasn’t seeing much edgy content coming from the Democratic Party. “Do you know why?,” she asked me. “No one will commission it.”

“We say this all the time,” she continued. “When the fuck is somebody going to let us build, like, a Glossier model of paid influencers? But nobody on the Democratic side gets it yet. And it’s wild but true that it benefits them to lose control of the message.”

Tucked away on page 46 of a Senate Select Committee on Intelligence–requested report concerning Russian disinformation in the 2016 presidential election is a fascinating detail. Almost every piece of political content that Russia’s Internet Research Agency shared via shady accounts on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter was created in-house — except, the report concluded, for memes created by Turning Point USA, a conservative campus organization. Not only did the IRA distribute these widely but they branded them as their own.

Founded in 2012, TPUSA has found its footing in the Trump era as a de facto youth wing of the administration. And what started as a campus-organizing vehicle has diversified into a gigantic content creator devoted to churning out viral pro-Trump memes and videos. In July, TPUSA held its second annual Teen Student Action Summit at a hotel in downtown Washington, D.C. On the day I attended, the president himself was delivering a speech, which meant hordes of preppy teenagers in red baseball caps had camped out overnight in the lobby to secure good seats. MAGA internet personalities were in abundance. Waiting for the president, the crowd hailed the arrival of @fleccas, a.k.a. Austen Fletcher, who interviews people on YouTube with a spoon taped to his microphone and has around 275,000 Instagram followers. Mobbed, he was forced to take endless selfies.

For me, the draw was Benny Johnson. Johnson’s journalism career, at BuzzFeed and elsewhere, had been marred by plagiarism scandals, which hadn’t prevented him from attaining his current job as chief creative officer of Turning Point USA, where he is paid to make memes. Dressed in a sharp blue suit and a teal necktie, Johnson assumed the stage at 9 a.m. to EDM beats and revival-tent pandemonium. “This is amazing!,” he yells. “Preach! Who wants to go to a church? Who wants to go to a meme church?”

Johnson played a clip of former White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders mocking a CNN reporter. “What savagery! We’re living in a savage environment,” he said. “We are living in a new world. The world of my dreams. A savage world where politics and meme culture have become one.”

The bulk of Johnson’s presentation, called “How Conservatives Are Winning the Meme Wars,” focused on a meme he had created of Senator Lindsey Graham during Brett Kavanaugh’s Supreme Court confirmation hearings. The image may be familiar even to those who don’t follow @TPUSA: It shows Graham smiling and coolly adjusting his tie as a female protester yells in the background. Johnson had been filming Graham as he walked from the Capitol to his SUV; later, at his desk, Johnson froze the video and saw internet gold. The image — self-assured Republican owns hysterical lib — went viral, and the meme became known as “Based Lindsey Graham.” Based Lindsey Graham then turned into a fad called “Grahaming,” in which conservatives adjust their ties for the camera. Graham now can’t go anywhere without someone wanting to Graham with him. Inevitably, people starting setting the video clip to music: “Ring of Fire,” “I Will Always Love You,” “Old Town Road.” The meme works.

Johnson argued that he has cornered the niche market, where liberals are no longer winning the culture war. “ ‘Why the left can’t meme’: That’s sort of the thesis of my show,” he told me later on. “It’s very simple. They’re not funny. Do you ever watch late-night television? Orange man bad. NPC. We’re allowed to laugh still. We’re allowed to think things are funny.” (“NPC” is gaming argot for “non-player character” and maga shorthand for a stilted, humorless lib. It has become a meme.)

But it’s the White House’s explicit embrace of figures like Johnson that has turned TPUSA into an unofficial administration content machine. It’s difficult to imagine that happening in quite the same way on the left. “I walk into the White House,” Johnson said, referring to the social-media summit that took place over the summer. “What’s printed out on giant poster boards? Memes. It’s incredible. Funny memes.”

A little over two years ago, some unusual political activity was taking place during a mayoral election in Lewiston, Maine. The Democratic candidate and favorite to win was Ben Chin, organizer for a progressive advocacy group. The Republican was Shane Bouchard, a city councilman. In early December, just over a week before the election, a blind item appeared in a largely dormant conservative website called the Maine Examiner, reporting that Chin had sent an email to his staff claiming that “voters in Lewiston’s Ward 6 are racists.” What Chin actually said was that he had encountered a “bunch of racists” (plus non-racists) while knocking on doors. But the damage was done. The Maine Republican Party promoted the story heavily, and the email “scandal” dominated the last week of the campaign.

It turns out one of Chin’s volunteers, Heather Everly Berube, had been having an affair with Bouchard during the campaign. At some point, she had forwarded Chin’s email to Bouchard, and from there, it ended up on the Examiner — which, as it happens, was owned and operated by a man named Jason Savage, the director of the Maine Republican Party. Chin lost the election by 145 votes.

A while back, I heard the progressive digital strategist Tara McGowan use a term for certain sites. Owned media, she called them, as in, you own all the content, so you can publish whatever you want. This is exactly what Savage did via the Examiner, where he had exploited the gaps in local-news coverage. A more prominent case study occurred in early 2019, when a conservative website called Big League Politics, owned by a political operative, broke the Ralph Northam blackface scandal.

The number of newsy-looking, hyperpartisan websites like this is growing, almost entirely on the right. In 2017, a Breitbart contributor named Michael Patrick Leahy started a site called the Tennessee Star, which has since expanded to include the Ohio Star, the Minnesota Sun, and the Michigan Star. None of them run much local news. Several times over the summer, Trump’s Facebook page linked to the Minnesota Sun, which published an op-ed by the chief operating officer of Trump’s reelection campaign. In 2018, California representative Devin Nunes promoted right-wing stories on a bogus site called the California Republican.

This is the space McGowan initially sought to infiltrate. If Democrats couldn’t compete with puerile internet humor, local news seemed like a more winnable space. In 2016, she was the digital director for the Priorities USA super-PAC. Frustrated by its hidebound, TV-ad-centric playbook, after the election she started her own shop, Acronym, armed with high-profile donors and partners like former Obama consigliere David Plouffe.

Last summer, Acronym began funding the Dogwood, a Virginia-centric media outlet designed to take market share away from the likes of Big League Politics. An Arizona equivalent followed in the fall, and Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, North Carolina, and Michigan sites have been staffing up. McGowan’s is framing partisan content as straight news, yes, but she’s also hiring real journalists and not making stuff up.

Perhaps as a result, the sites seem to lack viral potential, specializing in light outrage bait like “How much does college cost in Virginia? A lot.” The Dogwood was promoted heavily on Facebook in the run-up to the 2019 Virginia election, in which Democrats swept both chambers of the state legislature. But its Facebook page has just a little over 5,000 fans and, on many posts, fairly low engagement. Mostly, it resembles a local spin on ThinkProgress, the liberal blog that recently ceased publishing.

This past fall, Acronym announced a $75 million digital-ad campaign aimed at voters in swing states. Maybe that’s the more realistic path for now. “I just can’t see us making our own Fox News,” Betsy Hoover of Higher Ground Labs tells me. Or populate “the darker corners of the internet down the line.”

But maybe there are compromises the Democratic Party is learning to make. A couple days before Thanksgiving, BuzzFeed News reported that a pro-Cory Booker super-PAC, United We Win, had placed an ad on a leading influencer marketplace, AspireIQ, looking for fund-raisers: “Tell your supporters to keep Cory in the fight with a small donation.” A debate broke out in the influencer community about whether or not the posting was appropriate, and AspireIQ pulled its ad.

Quietly, though, United We Win kept the influencer outreach alive. It had also solicited ads on Tidal Labs and Tribe, two similar marketplaces, and eventually commissioned 37 influencers to flack for Booker, about half of whom were paid between $100 and $500 per post. (The other half volunteered.) The campaign ran for two weeks, ending on December 13, and yielded 140 pieces of original content. Which is why a ripped, often shirtless influencer called Derrick Downey Jr. posted an Instagram post of himself using a weight machine on December 9.

Being fit physical consist of determination, hard work, care and zero excuses. The same principles apply when I look for someone to provide leadership for our country. That’s why I believe #CoryBooker is fit for the job. #UnitedWeWin #ad PAID FOR UNITED WE WIN SUPER PAC

I asked Curtis Hougland, the influencer broker of Main Street One, if he was behind them. He declined to comment. I checked the Federal Election Commission website. The pro-Booker super-PAC had reported independent expenditures of $525,846. Their recipient: Main Street One. #Sponcon has arrived in this presidential race. It’s a little gross. That might be okay?

*This article appears in the December 23, 2019, issue of New York Magazine. Subscribe Now!

240,000 Census Workers Were Added to the Job Rolls in August.
Photo: Ben Hasty/Medianews Group/Reading Eagle Via Getty Images

Friday’s Jobs Report Contained Some Good News, but The Political Forecast for More Measures that Might Boost The Economy is decidedly More mixed. I spoke with Business Columnist Seduce About The Central Takeaways.

Ben: This Morning’s Jobs Report Showed that unlemployment in america has fallen from 10.2 percent to 8.4 percent (an artificial Large DROP CCAUSE of the Temporary Hiring of Census workers) and that 1.37 million new jabs created in august, beating expertations of 1.35 million. So there’s some good news, but businesses are bringing furlughed Workers back at a slower than they were, and, of courtes, remain non -blessing. What Were Your Central Takeways From this Snapshot of the Economy?

seduce: This was a good Report. As you Note, it is somewhat inflated by census hiring of About 240,000, but excluding that, it shows what would ordinarily be consider blocbuster of Over a Million Jobs. The Question is How Much of a Blockbuster EACH MONTH’S REPORT OUGHT to be right now. WE LOST OVER 20 MILLION Jobs in April, and, Together, The Jobs Reports Since Thats Have US About Halfway Back. I Think there are good reasons to be concertned that fiscal suport, which was robust in the sprouting act act stimulating and enhanced umployment, is no longer as the economy needs and that there be be some softness in emploment, as consumers. prepared to spend than they should be. On the Other Hand, Some of the Softness is Simply Due to Pandemic Conditions-Hotels Are Bight Two-Thirds of Their Normal Employment Levels, But I’m Not Sure We Should a Lot more Travel Right Now. HEY PANDEMIC CONDITIONS ARE BETTER, LIKE IN MUCH OF EUROPE, THAT STUFF IS COMING BACK SLOWLY, IN PART BECAGE TRAVELING IS AN ASPECT OF CAUTION TOWARD CORONavirus. So while i’m worked that the rebound is going to go Slower in the fall than it should, I think this report is broadly.

Ben: The Coronavirus is Still Taching a Grievous Toll, Killing Around a Thousand Americans Each Day The Last Couple Weeks. But there is at least some positiv news: CASES ARE WELL DOWN FROM WHAT THERE A MONTH OR TWO AGO (THOUG HAVE PLATEUED at the High Level of More than 40,000 a Day), and Deaths Are Slowly Dropping. To what extent would you think this reasonably decoct data is just a result of the Country Taming the virus slightly poorly than it was before?

seduce: The Jobs Report Reflects the Employment Situation As of the Week of August 12, so it is already a few weeks in the rear window. Daily Case Cases Were Lower in August than in July and Continue to Be Lower Than they were in august, so i think that improved in virus conditions was a tailwind, allowing continuous and renormalization in industries Like restaunts and hotels. JUST THIS WEEK, GYMS ARE REOPENING IN NEW YORK CITY. So i think that a factor suppueting job gains in this report, and one that will will Support gains in september. Remember, back in august at we got the July Report, a lot of People were surpassed that Report Showed Continued Gains, as virus conditions were worse in july than june. This reflects improving virus conditions, and so should next month’s date.

Ben: There’s Been an Assumpion Among Many that democrats and republicans would eventually get together and pass another stimulus bill, which wouldnt prevents and cities from enormous budget shortfalls, transportation systems from teetering near collapse, and small bunsses. Another Few Months of Misery, Among Other Things. But talks between the two sides are basically nonexistant at this point, and republicans will undoubtedly use the latis-positive economic news to dig in their harder on doing nothing. What if a bill just… doesn’t opening anytime soon? Or at all?

seduce: SO, I HAD been a skeptic on the president’s staffing to use Executive orers as a substitute for that relief bill. But the $ 300 UNEMPLOYMENT enhancement he funded by shifting disaster-relief Money from female is actually going out in many states and will ultimately be paid by mers. The CDC’s Sweeping Order Barring Evictions of Most Households May Not Stand Up in Court, but it should, for a time, delay some of the Economic Dislocation that Might Have Resulted Evications. And the stimulus in the Spring was, from a macroeconomic perspective, more than sufficient: Households took in More Money Than they Could Spend, orirair Their Consumption was actually Due to pandemic at the same. The average worker on umployment benefits was earning significantly more than his or her previous wage. That all created a consideble cushion that has gioven a lot of Households Room to Wait Out Congressional Inaction. All of which is to say i am not sura sura that insufficient fiscal support is as big a threat to the economy over the next couple of months as a lot of People think. But the longer we did with a relief bill, the most that household cushion will go away, and the most certin businesses calling the “temporalily” Close Close permanently. There will will be willy to thusands of layoffs specifically in the airline industry, if theyrair industry-specific rescue package is not extended past september 30. And after a few Weeks, the female Money Moved Over (Under Dubious Legal Authority) to enhancent ENEMPLOENT ENEMPLOYT Benefits Will Run Out. So there are some significant risk, but i think they have innings been overstaated.

Photo-illustration: by the cut; Photos: Retilers

Shopping for Father’s Day Gifts is always a Challenge, Since the sampular options are eather incredibly cliché or corny as hell. Does the dad or faher figure in your life really want another Coffee Mug? Probably swimming. Luckily for you, we have some much better ideas that your dad will appreciate. Read on to Shop the best father’s day gifts that cut editors are gifting this year, including an Electric Salt-Pepper Set, Ana Ring, and A Journal that Perfect for Bookworms.

That’s though my dad doesn’t really cook, he loves to put salt on literally everything, so i know he’ll get a lot of use of this electric salt-and-pepper. The Sleek Stainless Steel Will Also Look Nice in My Parent’s Kitchen. – Hanna Flanagan, Shopping Writer and Editor.

My dad is on somewhat of a health Journey (aside from the excesses amount of salt) and recently got into hot yoga. This Gift is Pricey, but i’m Consding Him anura Ring to Track His Fitness Progress, Sleep, and Biometrics. I’ve been wearing one for about six months now and absolutely love it. I think he will, too. – HF

Like My Dad Always Sayys, One Can Never Have Too Many Golf Shirts. I do not normally gift him cloting Becuses he has Very Particular Taste, but this polo shirt seames a safe choice it has a classic fit and compa neutral colors. He is also just obsessed with all things Lululemon so i know it will be a hit. – HF

I KNOW GIFTING YOUR DAD A PAIR OF PAJAMA PANTS ISN’T GROUNDBREAKING, but it is always a success. My dad love to lounge around, so this pair from tommy john is perfect SINCE ITS INCREDIBLY SOFT AND HAS POLLESS FOR HIM TO HIS WALLET AND KEYS IN ISH’S FEELING EXTRA LAZY FOR LAST-MINUTE GROCERY RUN MY MOM MOTH MODS ON. – Bianca Nieves, Senior Shopping Editor.

If your faater figure is a bookworm, I highly recommend gifting say this book Journal from molekine. I know my granda would’ve loved recipes so he could track downe book he read. He was Truly a Walking Encyclopedia. – bn

For the dads who are just dyscovering matcha, this fellow kettle is incredibly chic. I used one on a trip to japan and immediatly gained to buy it. IT CAN HEAT WATER TO WHAT TEMPERATURE YOU WANT, ALLOWING YOU TO ROAST COFFEE, Whisk Matcha, and Brew Tee Perfectly. Plus, IT LOOKS INCREDIBLY CHIC ON THE KITCHEN COUNTER. – Joanna Nikas, Deputy Style Editor

Elevate Your Dad’s WorkSpace with this Leatherology Desk Pad. It is Made with Italy Leather and is Water and Scratch-Resistant. I am impartial to the extra-long size Becuses it elevates the space and also acts as a mouse pad. You can Also personalized it with a nice note. – Jn

I’m the body-oil queen. My Brother Constantly Compulations with and Asks for the Male Version of what i use. I WOLDN’T GIFT HIM MY OILS WITH SPARKLES, but SINCE HAS HAS MULTIPLE TATTOOS, I’M GIFTING HIM THIS: A Hydrating Stick by the rock. It keeps his skin nourished, and it smells great, too. – Asia Milia Ware, Beauty Editor

I GREW UP Watching My Uncles Play Card Games and Chess During Summer Barbecues. My way of showing say love darring over -day is gifting say my version of a luxury chess set. – amw

I’m notorious for giving the men in my family family. The Oakwood and Vanilla Notes in This Schent Are Mysterious But Bold. The Packaging is Also something the me in my life would love to have on their shelves. – amw

Perfums de Marly scents are unique and longing. My dad tells with the Brand Makes His “Attractive” Spect, whatever that means. This new fragrance is for the men who loves Fresh scents. Made with Bergamot and Ginger; Ideal for the man who doesn’t want something Warm. – amw

I GREW UP DOING PUZZLES LIKE THESE MY DAD, SPPING COFFEE IN OUR PAJAMAS while the Morning News Played. One Year, i Bought Him This Puzzle Board (Because the perpetually half-finished puzzles covering the coffee table boored my mom). Another year, i made a family Photo Into a Puzzle. This year, i’m giving Him this National Park Puzzlewhere we last tok a family trip. Puzzles are a perfect balance between gifting an Item and an experience, and they’re endlessly customizable. – Gray Battle, Editorial Intern

Photo: Chuck Zlotnick/Columbia Pictures/Everett Collection

Tom Holland is on a break from filming the upcoming fourth Spider-man Movie, Brand New Dayafter suffering a Mild Concsion on September 19 while on Set, for People. We don’t know how exactly Holland was injured, but he reportly fell while filming a stunt and was rushed to the hospital, accorting to the Daily Mail. A spokesperson for the East of England Ambulance Service Told The Sun that they were Called at “10:30 am on Friday to atttent to a patient who has had been injury at leavesden studios in watford.” No One Else Sustained Injuries, for The Hollywood Reporterbut film is currently on pause. The Movie, which Began Filming in August, is Still Scheduled to Be Relessed in Theaters on July 31, 2026.

Luckily, Holland Was Feeling Well Enough to Appear with Zendaya at the Brothers Trust Posh Quiz on September 20, The Day AFTER HIS ACCIDENT, FOR People. Holland Founded Brothers Trust in 2017; The Charity use His Celebrity to Raise Funds for Other Charities that “Struggle to Be Heard.” Hosted Hosted the Public But Reportedly Left Early, Acciting to The Sun.

“This format will always exist, just perhaps not on network television.” Photo: Michele Crowe/CBS via Getty Images

It’s been ten years since David Letterman stepped away from the grind of hosting a late-night talk show, but time has not dulled his legendarily dry wit, even though at least one member of his family wishes it had. “For some reason, my wife — we’ve been married for 72 years — has decided that she’s my public defender,” the comedy icon tells me, his voice as affably grumpy as ever. “So whenever we go anyplace and I say, ‘Oh, what is this, a parakeet?’ when we’re clearly in Whole Foods, she will say, ‘Oh, he’s kidding. No, no, it’s a joke. He’s kidding.’ And that happens all the time now.”

Letterman pretends his wife’s commentary is annoying, but really, this anecdote is just another way to poke fun at himself: The subtext of her Dave-splaining is that his celebrity has faded to the point that strangers need to be assured they haven’t stumbled upon a very confused 78-year-old man. “I used to hope that the audience, whether it’s one or 1,000, would recognize that something was a joke,” Letterman says. “But the index of those who know who I am? Getting smaller every day. So in a way, I guess she’s doing me a favor because I could easily be zip-tied and hauled out of these places.”

And yet, while Letterman may not be at the center of the cultural Zeitgeist the way he was ten or 15 years ago, he has hardly disappeared into the background. His Netflix interview show, My Next Guest Needs No Introduction, has snagged multiple Emmy nominations (and one win) since launching in 2018 and, earlier this summer, netted a two-season renewal from the streamer. Rather than jumping on the celebrity-podcast bandwagon, Letterman has instead offered fans regular updates (and flexed his comedic muscles) as a permanent guest on The Barbara Gaines Show, a YouTube series fronted by the former Late Night executive producer (and often co-hosted by My Next Guest producer Mary Barclay). The show is hosted on Letterman’s own robust YouTube channel, which is updated regularly with new (and often timely) clips from the Letterman library, including musical performances. And in December, Letterman partnered with Samsung to launch a free, ad-supported (a.k.a. FAST) TV channel dubbed Letterman TV. Available via the electronics giant’s Samsung TV Plus platform, the virtual channel offers a curated collection of Letterman sketches and interviews along with newly taped intros and commentary from the host himself.

Until now, Letterman TV has relied exclusively on 22 years’ worth of output from the comedian’s CBS Late Show, which was produced and owned by his Worldwide Pants production company. But as part of a new agreement with NBCUniversal being unveiled today, the channel will also begin streaming content from Letterman’s NBC Late Night era, adding material from more than 1,800 episodes to the mix. Content will be regularly refreshed, but the initial batch of programming set to go live on September 10 includes packages of appearances by Pee-wee Herman, Andy Kaufman, and Steve Martin, plus a handful of full-length episodes such as the series premiere (with guest Bill Murray), the one-year anniversary special, and themed episodes like “Camping With Barry White.”

Unlike many talent-specific FAST channels that can be viewed across a variety of platforms (Pluto TV, the Roku Channel, etc.), Letterman TV — along with a similar Conan O’Brien channel that debuted in 2023 — is exclusive to Samsung devices. Because of that, Samsung TV Plus content chief Takashi Nakano says the platform is dedicating “more firepower” to get the channel in front of its global audience of nearly 90 million monthly active users. “We do promote it heavily because of this,” he says. “We have access to Times Square, we have access to other large screens that we can do massive promotions around, and our marketing team has got a robust plan to make this come to life across our platforms. We are going to put a lot of muscle behind it. And so is Dave, by the way.”

Indeed he is: In conjunction with the arrival of the new Late Night library on his FAST channel, Letterman last week hopped on the phone with Vulture for a 40-minute conversation on an array of topics. He talked about his NBC years, of course, including the incredibly short-lived daytime talk show that paved the way for Late Night, and why so many of his best-known bits would work today in the age of viral social-media moments. Letterman also had thoughts about the chumminess among today’s late-night hosts, his love for John Mulaney, his complicated relationship with Jay Leno, the future of late night, and, yes, CBS’s decision to cancel not only Stephen Colbert but the entire franchise Letterman created more than 32 years ago.

Hello, David, and first of all, thank you for your time. How are you?
Well, Joe, I was thinking about this: You and I have known each other forever at this point.

I mean, I’ve known you forever, certainly, and I’ve been covering you since I started working as a reporter in (redacted). So yes, it’s been quite a while.
Yeah, well, it’s nice to have a relationship this long with somebody who kind of has witnessed all of this mess. Thank you.

I’m no Bill Carter, but I try. And my hair is getting whiter, so …
Bill Carter? (Laughs.) Oh, my goodness. Bill Carter, the man who’s made a career out of late-night TV. He really has. God bless him. He’s soliciting money. He’s starting a late-night theme park.

See, that’s one good reason to do your Netflix show and put your library on free streaming services: to make sure the kids today know who you are and what late-night TV is all about.
Oh, God bless the kids today.

Letterman with Bill Murray on NBC’s Late Night. Photo: NBC

Speaking of which, we’re doing this interview partly because of the return of your original NBC series, Late Night, to TV via Samsung TV Plus and its Letterman TV channel. I want to go back to the launch of that show and try to get into your head about what was going on then. A couple of years earlier, NBC had given you a daytime talk show, and it was canceled after just a few months because of lousy ratings. How did that whole experience impact you and the process of creating Late Night?
I appreciate this, because it sparks memories. Looking at it now, with age, that was a fascinating life experience. I left Indiana thinking, Everything that’s wrong with television and television comedy, I have the solution. And as soon as I get out there, just hang on. If you folks can wait it out another year or two, I will solve everything that’s wrong with comedy on television.

Now, I will say that was before Saturday Night Live, so they helped my load be a little lighter in the lift, in my mind. And we dropped down at, I think, ten in the morning, or nine in the morning across the NBC television network. And the producer of that show quit the Friday before it was to go on the air because he didn’t get it. We didn’t get him. We locked heads. It was nothing but screaming fights. We had no other guidance, no North Star, except, You know what? We’re all sick of these game shows; just wait until you get a look at us. And boy, was that a huge lesson for me. I realized, Yeah, you really don’t know what you’re talking about.

And then, like you say, a month and a half, 16 weeks, whatever it was, we’re gone, and we completely blew up the daytime network-television schedule at NBC. The fact that they were able to keep me around, and that year of not having anywhere to go except comedy clubs was a sad, sad experience for me because in show business, as with life, you get your one shot, and if it doesn’t work, you go to the end of the line. And who knows how long that line is? So against my own ego, against my own better judgment, we had to sit down. And it was a learning process. But boy, it was tough. It was really tough, because just the ego involved with the Wait until you get a look at us was so misguided.

The thing is, you were right that you were going to change things in comedy and TV, and ultimately that’s what happened with Late Night. To me, it just seems that Fred Silverman and the execs at NBC didn’t quite realize your comedy might not have been right for daytime-TV audiences in 1980. People really liked The Hollywood Squares, which was one of several game shows canceled to make room for your program.
The Hollywood Squares, there’s a fine show. There was nothing wrong with Hollywood Squares. I think they still do it somewhere, don’t they?

They do. It keeps coming back. I think you’ve been on some version of it, haven’t you?
I was on Hollywood Squares. I don’t know that I was on the original 1960s Hollywood Squares with Paul Lynde and Wally Cox. But yeah, that show was very funny. But I just think the morning show was a huge lesson for me in Okay, Mr. Big Shot, let’s get a hold of ourselves and try it again.

I’ve seen some clips of the morning program, and what strikes me is how much of the DNA of Late Night was there, right down to the jokes about New York in the introduction and segments like “Small Town News.” How did you decide what to keep and what to change when you started putting Late Night together? I mean, you obviously wanted to stay true to who you were, but you’d just had this ratings failure, so was there any second-guessing going on about what would work?
Well, it was interesting because of the failure of the daytime show and restrictions that were placed on us in order to protect our relationship with The Tonight Show. It was nothing punitive, but there were certain restrictions: no monologue, no big orchestra, and we couldn’t book the same guests they were booking. All of those things actually worked in our favor. We had a tremendous group of musicians, I was not up to carrying a Johnny Carson monologue for ourselves, and the people he was booking were probably of no interest to us at that time. That all changed, of course. But that helped us.

Now, the other side of this was, every second I was on the air, I was waiting to get the hook. Because we had come and gone so quickly and the result of it was just darkness for a year, I feared that. So I’m torn between the two things: It didn’t work the first time; we have reasons now to alter the show or to keep it the same way, but what the hell happens if this goes away? So the first two or three months, I think we were all nervous about the outcome. But then again, you have to remember: Those days, there was nothing on opposite us. So, no offense, you could have had a show that would’ve been successful. And I mean that only with love, Joe.

Any specific memories of that first episode of Late Night? I’m excited that it will be officially streaming.
Well, we had several first shows: the first show on the daytime show, the first show on the NBC show, and the first show on the CBS show. And it’s always like you’re getting ready for the Rose Parade. You have the Rose Parade and then it’s, Oh, geez, what are we doing tomorrow? I think that was typical of the daytime show, the Late Night show, and then the Late Show: After all of the effort, all of the energy goes into that first show, now what do we do? It’s not until about a month and a half in that you establish a rhythm of production that will hold you, that will prop you up for the rest of the run. But until you are comfortable with that, it’s going to be a struggle.

Letterman with Paul Reubens. Photo: NBC

Your NBC late-night show was actually produced by Johnny Carson’s company. So that essentially made the man you idolized your boss, or at least your partner. Was he a silent partner, or did he chime in much during the run?
To my memory, Johnny couldn’t have cared less, except whatever cut of the budget he got. We were of no threat to him. He was still the king of the heap. To him, we were just, “Eh, okay, call me when they’re canceled.” He was always very nice. He would have me on from time to time, and we would promote the show. But I think he found it amusing. And who knows? I never really asked him what he thought of the show, but I always felt like, if you’re not as good as Johnny, really, is there any point in leaving Indiana?

But if you look at Johnny’s work now, my God, it was just solid. Pick one night of one week — the first year, the eighth year, the 20th year — he’s just rock solid. He’s like the very best home-health-care person you could afford. He’s constant, doesn’t miss a beat, doesn’t get you worried. I mean just, good lord, who can do that? I always felt I fell short of that. I feel everybody else doing it falls short of it. The only person I think didn’t fall short of that was Regis Philbin. Regis was, you know, “Get on, and when we hit your stop, let me know, because I’m going to keep going.” He was fantastic. And Johnny? The best.

Let’s talk about Letterman TV, the FAST channel you launched last year. What was your reaction when your team brought the idea of licensing your library to Samsung TV Plus, as well as the early move to put clips up on your YouTube channel? It’s a wholly logical idea, but you’re someone who famously doesn’t seem to like revisiting older stuff.
I don’t know what your age is, but we used to have an answering machine on the phone that I couldn’t figure out. So anything in the digital world has been a very complex mystery for me. And without the world of the internet, I don’t know what would’ve become of the material.

I think we got into it a little late, because we just weren’t sure how to do it or what the interest might be. We started the YouTube operation, and I liked the idea of centralizing this material for those who may be interested. Then, out of nowhere, came the offer from Samsung to be another library for this material. So I feel just dumb lucky to have these opportunities because, without that, I would not have known what to do. Not only that, I would not have thought there was much interest, because all of these shows we’re talking about now are decades, decades old. And the culture changes so rapidly, generation to generation, that who knows of what use, if any, they might be for any reason?

Are you happy with the response so far to the YouTube and Samsung channels?
I’m just happy now to have been able to have a bit of control with the inventory. And beyond that, if it works, well, how flattering is that? It’s pretty good, because the idea of having done all of those shows was one thing. It’s just, Oh, okay, I completed a marathon. I completed a triathlon. And that’s it. But now, well, you have some evidence here, so it’s greatly flattering. And like I say, the digital strategy was nothing that I thought of. We’re still new to this. But so far, the reaction, I think, has been pretty positive. For an old man, that’s flattering.

Let’s get back to Late Night. When your CBS show ended ten years ago, I wrote a story about how, starting on NBC, you were doing viral moments before we called them that — things like “Stupid Pet Tricks” or the “Top 10 List” or you throwing yourself against a wall while wearing a Velcro suit. These are things that would blow up on social media and YouTube today.
I think you’re right. It had not occurred to me that what we were doing would’ve been apt now. But I will say a lot of that came to me from Steve Allen, who was doing this stuff in the ’50s and ’60s. There was no wackier guy on television, and I think he had maybe three different passes at a late-night show. And the one I saw, the one that really made sense to me, was where he was the human tea bag. But I took a lot of that spirit with me to what I thought was just great good fun.

Now you’ve obviously inspired several generations of TV hosts. Jimmy Kimmel has been most vocal about crediting you with influencing his sense of humor, and I know you have a great relationship with Conan O’Brien, who succeeded you at NBC. And then just a few months ago, John Mulaney used your visit to his Netflix show to tell you what watching Late Night and Late Show meant to him. You two seemed to really bond during that appearance.
I would, right now, drive cross-country and back in a rental car with John Mulaney, without stopping, other than for gas. I find this kid so … I struggle to describe him. He’s so good at what he does. He’s so appealing, and the struggle he’s had, the obstacles he has put in his own path and overcome, I find inspirational. I’m late to the fact that some of our show was the reason for his show. I don’t know if there’s a paper trail on that. Or maybe some remote DNA. But even without that, I just love the kid. He’s so bright. I find that stand-up comedy is so superior now to when I was toying around with it. I could go on and on about what a thrill my friendship with John Delaney is. John Mulaney. We’re so close that I call him “Delaney.”

You and Mulaney have something else in common, which is that you both host talk shows on Netflix. Yours has just been renewed for two more seasons. It really seems to have become a perfect outlet for someone who doesn’t want to retire but has also moved past the grind of a daily show. It seems to really work for you.
Well, it does work for me because there’s not much else I can do in life professionally. And thanks to the good friends at CAA and the good friends at Netflix, this came to pass. And I love it because I get to meet and spend time with people like John Mulaney. I mean, this is how I fell in love with the kid. The same with Tina Fey. I’m grateful to have this opportunity. The schedule is so much better than five nights a week.

I love that the show is so focused on a single interview each episode, with you just drilling down on what your guests are about as opposed to their latest project. It fills the void left by the late, great Tom Snyder, whom you brought to CBS for a few years to fill the time slot behind you. Your production company, Worldwide Pants, owns the rights to his episodes of The Late Late Show. It would be so great to see more of those episodes again.
Oh my God, Tom Snyder. Boy, I remember when he had The Tomorrow Show and I was working at the ABC affiliate in Indianapolis. We signed off at a quarter of one or one o’clock, and then the only thing left on TV was The Tomorrow Show. I would race home and watch. I mean, he was doing Ed Murrow, even to the extent of smoking on-camera. Then we were lucky enough to get in production with him on the CBS show. I hope that has another life because, I don’t know, you wonder what would become of people like Tom, people like me, people like Jimmy and Stephen, if they didn’t have network TV now. Where would these guys flourish? I think they would probably find their way. But Tom was that guy where just, like, boom, you’re in Tom’s head and you’re going to stay there for an hour. It was great. So I keep forgetting we control that. I hope we can do something with it.

Letterman with Andy Kaufman (left) and Jerry Lawler. Photo: NBC

I want to ask you about CBS’s decision not only to part ways with Stephen Colbert but essentially to exit the late-night talk-show space. CBS didn’t just decide to part ways with Colbert; it canceled the franchise you and your team built. CBS very famously had been unable to have any success in late night before you arrived. Not even Pat Sajak could get an audience in the slot. You’ve talked a bit about what happened to Colbert specifically. But is there a part of you that is disappointed or sad or even angry about CBS essentially flushing away something you created?
Well, before we discuss “something we started and we created,” I’m not sure that’s accurate in my case. I remember Jack Rollins, who was my manager forever, one day saying to me, “David, it’s like a paper cup: You have a drink of water, then you crumple it up and throw it away.” And of everything Jack provided for me in my life, that’s the silly thing that stuck with me. Try to hang on to that: Everything changes. There’s a time and place for everything.

So it didn’t even dawn on me, when Stephen announced that he was being taken off the air, that the whole franchise was gone. Then the more I thought of it, it clearly was mishandled. It clearly was not, “Oh, he’s bleeding money.” There are ways to make money. There are ways to hide money. I mean, I spent most of my life hiding my money in Panama. You know that. We all know that.

Of course.
CBS could have figured this out. And to unload him after they made a deal with the administration for 60 Minutes? It smelled bad. Let’s just take them at their word that “No, it didn’t smell bad. We were losing money.” Okay, but find a way to make it not smell bad. It just looked ridiculous.

But it’s no surprise. I can remember Jay Leno used to say to me, when we were going head-to-head, (imitates Leno’s voice) “Nah, there’s plenty of room. There’s room for both of us.” And I kept thinking, Well, no, there’s not room for both of us. Then suddenly, there were three shows and maybe more. But as we’re seeing now, there really isn’t much room left for anybody.

That’s depressing.
Yeah. But this format will always exist, just perhaps not on network television any longer. Because it is just dirt cheap to produce compared to prime-time programs and half-hour comedies and such.

You mentioned Jay Leno just now. Do you speak to him at all these days? A lot of time has passed since you were competing against each other for ratings.
The last time I spoke to Jay — or maybe we just texted — he said his face had caught fire or something, and it sounded hideous. I mean, of things that might catch fire, perhaps the last thing you’d want to would be your face. So it was alarming. I think we exchanged sentiments about “Good luck, and be careful.” Something like that. But I haven’t spoken to him in a long time.

For anybody who went to California in the same period that I was there, Jay, without question was the gold standard; he was the North Star. There was nobody funnier than Jay. And people who see him now … I talked to a friend of mine who saw him do an hour, maybe a two-hour show, some kind of corporate gig. Just tremendous, just hilarious, just nonstop as funny as you’re ever going to get. So that’s the good thing about Jay.

We rubbed each other the wrong way. I don’t know. I don’t have any regrets about our relationship, and I don’t think he has any regrets about me, either. But God, he’s just really, even at this point in his career, probably still the best.

I’m very glad we’re in a world now where all the major late-night hosts seem to like one another and there’s no animus — except maybe between Conan and Jay.
I know. How did that happen? Because when it was me and Jay, it was the “Late Night Wars.” There was bloodshed! We hated each other! But now every day, they have lunch together. I don’t get it.

Speaking of Conan, you once famously gifted him a horse. Has he ever gotten you any fun gifts?
Conan has been very generous. A few years ago, after I was on his podcast early on, he found a historic musical instrument, an old version of a National guitar. I can’t play the guitar, but I love the idea of the National guitar. And he gave me one, and I’m so pleased to have it. He’s been nothing but kind and really a nice guy.

I think we’re already way over our scheduled time. Sorry about that.
Oh, no, no, no. Don’t apologize to me. You’re doing me a huge favor. It’s another opportunity to genuinely talk about myself. And I have to keep looking for people who haven’t heard me talk about myself, so this is great. Listen, Joe, I have to go take a shower now. This has worn me out.

I loved posing in front of the eiffel tower, taching a bite out of a baguette, and petting a poodle in album announcement all suggest it will be effhorityly French. Comeafter all, means “life” in that Language. The Feisty Singer and Rapper Has Also Said It Will Be “Pop-Driven,” As evidenced by the Jack Antonoff Co-Produced Lead Single, “Jealous Type.”

Photo-illustration: Curbed; Photo: Rouse + Co/Kyoshino

Part of Living in New York City is Thinking About Moving Out of New York City. Each month, we’ll round up the best listings with commuting -i distance, places where entires go for the cost of a “junior one-bedroom” but you’ll have to fix your ow toilet.

This Week We Have Some Ancient Houses, Plus A Modern Mid-Century on a Creek.

$ 750,000: 4-BEDROM, 2-BATH

This listing Photo Highlights One of the Best Parts of the House-An Eat Bay-Window Nook. Photo: Rouse + CO

Here’s a disgustingly Charming Gothic Revival. We love the budilt-ins and the pointed gothic-style Windows Throughout The House. The Highlight is an Incredible Bay with Arched Windows Where You Can Bathhe in Light and Drink Your Morning Coffee. The House was Built Around 1862, but everything that matters seames to have been renovated; The kitchen has a bertazzoni five-sourner stove for be you need to heat fivees at Once, and the full Bathroom upstairs has a marble shower. Other Details: The Living Room Has the Original Marble Mantle and Crown Moldings, and There’s A Pretty Cozy Sitting Room With Exposed Beams in the Back. IT’S HIGHER PRICED FOR THE AREA, but it’s on a lot tear with a two-car garage and is one of the best kept.

How to get back to the city?

It is a ten-minute drive to the hudson amtrak station, then two hours by train.

So, what do i love i live there?

Watch the Boats go by at the landing. Go Birding at the Ramshorn-Livingston Sanctuary. Get Coffee at Willa’s.

$ 1,495,000: 6-BEDROM, 4-Bath

The exteriors of the House as Shown in this listing Photo were transported all the way from pennsylvania. Photo: Four Seasons Sotheby’s

There’s a lot of Old – and we Mean Very Old – Details in This House, Such as the recialimed bricks highlighted in this listing Photo. Photo: Four Seasons Sotheby’s

If you’ve been dying to buy a house that was actually a barn built in pennsylvania in the 1800s, disassembled, then repstate new york in 1990, this is the listing for you. For fans of Old Stuff, this House is full of it-Wood Paneling from a 1780s English Manor, BRICK FLOORS From A 19th-Century Hudson Factory, Delft Tiles from 1760, and Hand-Carved Beams Throughout. Don’t worry, there’s new stuff, too – Bosch Appliances in the Kitchen and Solar Panels to your Energy. Is it expensive for the area? Maybe, but it has six bedrooms. Go Buy It With Some Friends. IT’S A GARDENER’S DREAM, with an 11-ACRE LOT NEXT TO WOODLAND.

How to get back to the city?

A Two-Hour Drive, or just 20 minutes to the Hudson Amtrak.

So, what do i love i live there?

Cool off at Lake Taghkanic State Park, and then stop at the west taghkanic diner for a sandwich after.

$ 635,000: 4-BEDROM, 2-BATH

The listing Photo Shows off the Dollhase Exterior of this Queen Anne Victorian. Photo: Howard Hanna Rand

The interiors of this house, like the kitchen featured in this listing Photo, will probably have to be updated. Photo: Howard Hanna Rand

This Queen Anne Victorian was BUILT in 1894 and has a turret – Basically a house out of a children’s picture book. There are lots of original details to love Throughout, like stained-gllas Windows, Pocket Doors, and Parquet Floors. Some of the interiors will have to be updated (Looking at you, Kitchen), but you can kep the tin ceilings and original Woodwork. The House Eve Comes with a 2,000-Square-Foot Outbuilding That Could House a Studio or Woodshop or, Say, Store Materials for A Renovation. IT’S A SMALL TOWN, But you’ll have neighbors on your street.

How to get back to the city?

Its just under a three-hour drive.

So, what do i love i live there?

Watch Twisters at the Greenville Drive-in.

$ 735,000: 2-BEDROM, 2-BATH

The Creek Captured in This Lis- PHOTO IS ONE OF THE MAIN DRAWS OF THIS HOUSE IN THE WOODS. Photo: Compass

The Mid-Century Modern House is Wide Open and Full of Light, as seen in this listing Photo. Photo: Compass

A Nice Mid-Century Modern Find, This House, Built in 1959, has an excellent stone fireplace and a beautiful creek running through the backyard. The interiors are airy, with an updated Open Kitchen and Floor-to-Cailing Windows in Nearly every Room Framing The Forest Views. Highlights Include a Stone-Covered Patio, Wide-Plank Floors, and Skylights in the Living Room. AS A Single-Storery Home, it’s one one you can Grow Old in. It ‘s tucked in on a quiet road.

How to get back to the city?

It’s a 2.5-hour drive.

So, what do i love i live there?

Go Fishing in Your Backyard or Hiking in the Catskills (Also in Your Backyard). The Tiny Town of Phoenicia is a Ten-Minute Drive Away.